NARUTO CORNER
02/16/2023
Leaving Poland for Japan at 19, She Became the First Female Non-Japanese Professional Shogi Player After Encountering the Game in NARUTO
Karolina Fortin became the first female, non-Japanese professional women's shogi player in February of 2017. Hailing from Poland, Karolina was first introduced to shogi when she was a 16-year-old reading a localized version of the NARUTO manga, which translated it in Polish as "Japanese chess". She was intrigued by the unfamiliar game, and before long, her interest developed into a newfound passion.
She honed her skills in online matches, and first came to Japan when she was 19, hoping to become a professional. The path to becoming a professional women's shogi player in a country far from her home was full of difficulties, but she says that in spite of that, she never once felt herself beginning to dislike the game. Like Naruto who steadfastly pursued his dream of becoming Hokage, she pressed on until she achieved her dream.
We spoke to Karolina about her first encounter with NARUTO, what she likes and remembers most about the series, and her journey to becoming a shogi professional.
She honed her skills in online matches, and first came to Japan when she was 19, hoping to become a professional. The path to becoming a professional women's shogi player in a country far from her home was full of difficulties, but she says that in spite of that, she never once felt herself beginning to dislike the game. Like Naruto who steadfastly pursued his dream of becoming Hokage, she pressed on until she achieved her dream.
We spoke to Karolina about her first encounter with NARUTO, what she likes and remembers most about the series, and her journey to becoming a shogi professional.
Karolina Fortin: The first non-Japanese women's shogi player to be recognized as a professional by the Japan Shogi Association. Originally from Warsaw, Poland. Mentored by Daisuke Katagami (7-dan). Graduated from Yamanashi Gakuin University's School of Management Information Sciences, before earning her master's degree in Social Sciences from the same university. Achieved the women's professional rank 2-kyu in 2017, and was promoted to 1-dan in 2021. After her marriage in 2022, her last name changed from Styczyńska to Fortin
*This interview was conducted by video call with Karolina, who lives in Switzerland
Inspired by Naruto's Perseverance Through Loneliness
—How did you first come to like NARUTO?
Karolina: I first saw the anime when I was 16. The arc with Zabuza was very interesting, and I never knew what was going to happen next. Then I found the manga at a bookstore and bought it immediately. I continued reading the series all the way to the end.
—That was 15 years ago, right? Was NARUTO famous even in Poland back then?
Karolina: Just about everyone in Poland knew about it, and I'd say it was among the top three most well-known manga in Europe. Ninja are pretty popular outside Japan as well, so I think we liked it because it was an interesting story themed around them that also gave us a glimpse into unfamiliar aspects of Japanese culture.
For example, during Kakashi's test at the beginning of the story, there are two bento lunches. In Europe we don't really have anything like bento, so it was fascinating to us.
Karolina: I first saw the anime when I was 16. The arc with Zabuza was very interesting, and I never knew what was going to happen next. Then I found the manga at a bookstore and bought it immediately. I continued reading the series all the way to the end.
—That was 15 years ago, right? Was NARUTO famous even in Poland back then?
Karolina: Just about everyone in Poland knew about it, and I'd say it was among the top three most well-known manga in Europe. Ninja are pretty popular outside Japan as well, so I think we liked it because it was an interesting story themed around them that also gave us a glimpse into unfamiliar aspects of Japanese culture.
For example, during Kakashi's test at the beginning of the story, there are two bento lunches. In Europe we don't really have anything like bento, so it was fascinating to us.
The ramen was also drawn in a way that looked incredibly delicious, and when I first tried it after coming to Japan I thought: "Ok, I get why Naruto likes this so much".
In addition, a lot of the jokes that appear in the manga didn't make sense to me at the time, but after studying more about Japan, I realized what they had been talking about. For me, that process of discovery was also very intriguing.
—Moving on to the story itself, what parts of it drew you in?
Karolina: In the beginning of the series Naruto is very isolated, but keeps moving forward and growing in spite of his loneliness. That really struck a chord with me. At the time I didn't have many friends myself, so I think I empathized with Naruto quite a bit.
Even aside from NARUTO, I think Japan's shonen manga are unique in that they tend to focus heavily on the emotional experiences of their protagonists. European comics don't have many series that address those issues. I think that makes it easy for people who are more sensitive to emotional subtleties to be drawn to the Japanese manga that depict them.
—By the way, who is your favorite character from the series?
Karolina: I'd have to say my favorite is Naruto, but Kakashi is pretty cool too.
—Moving on to the story itself, what parts of it drew you in?
Karolina: In the beginning of the series Naruto is very isolated, but keeps moving forward and growing in spite of his loneliness. That really struck a chord with me. At the time I didn't have many friends myself, so I think I empathized with Naruto quite a bit.
Even aside from NARUTO, I think Japan's shonen manga are unique in that they tend to focus heavily on the emotional experiences of their protagonists. European comics don't have many series that address those issues. I think that makes it easy for people who are more sensitive to emotional subtleties to be drawn to the Japanese manga that depict them.
—By the way, who is your favorite character from the series?
Karolina: I'd have to say my favorite is Naruto, but Kakashi is pretty cool too.
Of course I also like Shikamaru, since he's known for playing shogi in the series. The scene where he drops a lighter at the end of his fight with Hidan was very striking.
Even In Tough Times, Shogi Was Always Fun
—It was through NARUTO that you first became aware of shogi, right?
Karolina: Shogi was first mentioned in a conversation during the Chunin Exams arc, and I was immediately intrigued. The Polish edition translated it as "Japanese chess", but it was very different from the chess I was familiar with. I found the rule that allows you to use pieces captured from the other player as your own to be especially interesting.
Karolina: Shogi was first mentioned in a conversation during the Chunin Exams arc, and I was immediately intrigued. The Polish edition translated it as "Japanese chess", but it was very different from the chess I was familiar with. I found the rule that allows you to use pieces captured from the other player as your own to be especially interesting.
I looked it up online to try it myself and before I knew it, I found myself more passionate about shogi than I was about chess or any other game. I've tried many different games, but shogi's the only one I really stuck with for this long.
—How did you find people to play with when you were starting out?
Karolina: At first I found opponents online, and then started a shogi club with people I met who happened to live in the same area. I say "club" but we really just met at cafes and played shogi matches. I continued to play online as well, eventually working up the courage to reach out in English and find people to play with from all over the world. My first shogi boards were handmade. I would draw the grid on paper or carve it into a wine box.
—How did you find people to play with when you were starting out?
Karolina: At first I found opponents online, and then started a shogi club with people I met who happened to live in the same area. I say "club" but we really just met at cafes and played shogi matches. I continued to play online as well, eventually working up the courage to reach out in English and find people to play with from all over the world. My first shogi boards were handmade. I would draw the grid on paper or carve it into a wine box.
—So you learned more and more about shogi and started to assemble the things you needed along the way.
Karolina: Yes, but it didn't feel like learning. It was more that the pure joy that came from playing the game is what got me hooked. I took a shogi set with me to school, but would still be completely absorbed in it when I got home all the way up until bedtime. Sometimes I even skipped school to play online. I really wanted to spend every moment I could with the game.
I made a lot of friends and rivals as time went on, and started entering online tournaments as well. Because I hated losing, I did a lot of research and grew to understand shogi further, which made me fall in love with it even more, and then the cycle continued.
—It sounds like you developed several friendships through your many battles, just like Naruto! You first came to Japan in 2011 when you were 19. When did you know that you wanted to study shogi in Japan?
Karolina: I had wanted to visit Japan ever since I got into Japanese manga and anime. However, it's very far away from Poland and I didn't have a lot of money, so I wasn't able to make that happen. But, after I graduated college and began working and saving money, I started thinking more seriously about going. Then, when I was 19 I was able to play an instructional match with Ms. Kitao (Note: Madoka Kitao, professional women's shogi player, 2-dan), and she recommended that I come to Japan if I was interested in becoming a professional.
—When you were asked if you wanted to come to Japan and become a pro, what was your reaction?
Karolina: Of course, I was elated. I'd heard about women's professional shogi in Japan from my friends, and the idea of making a career out of shogi sparked my interest. Naturally, I was anxious about going to live in a far-off country by myself, and my parents were also concerned for my safety because this was right after the Great Tohoku Earthquake. But I knew a chance to become a pro in Japan would likely never come again, so I made the commitment and off I went.
Upon my arrival, I was shocked to learn you could watch shogi matches on TV. It was like a dream come true. And not only that, I could even find people to play against just by going to a shogi hall! To someone like me who had mostly only been able to play online, every day was an amazing experience. Playing face-to-face across a shogi board is a much more personal experience, and it's also a lot easier to sense your opponent's emotions.
—After beginning to study shogi in Japan, did your aspirations toward becoming a professional women's shogi player grow stronger?
Karolina: Yes, but the thing that really hardened my resolve to become a pro was participating in the Ricoh Cup Women's Oza Tournament as the non-Japanese representative in 2012 after temporarily returning to Poland. I was able to win against a professional women's shogi player and that really boosted my confidence.
However, having confidence didn't suddenly make things easy. Becoming a pro was a truly difficult process.
—In 2013, you were accepted into one of the Japan Shogi Association's training groups, working toward becoming a pro while simultaneously continuing your language studies at Yamanashi Gakuin University. What was the most difficult thing about that time in your life?
Karolina: I did a homestay with Ms. Kitao when I initially came to Japan at 19, but when I came back, I was living alone for the first time in my life. I still wasn't confident in my Japanese, so even going to the grocery store was a challenge. I was also busy with my studies, and it was difficult to balance school with shogi.
—But you persevered in your training, and in February of 2017 you were promoted to 2-kyu*, officially becoming the first non-Japanese women's professional shogi player.
*In women's shogi, players are recognized as professionals upon attaining the 2-kyu rank.
Karolina: After reaching 3-kyu, you have to achieve the results necessary to qualify for 2-kyu within two years or you cannot become a professional. I wasn't able to produce great results in my first year after becoming 3-kyu, so the pressure really started building. I remember being afraid that my decision to travel to Japan and all the effort I'd put in would amount to nothing.
But even with all that stress, I never once stopped enjoying shogi. It was hard, but the joy from playing and the fun of learning new things overshadowed that. Just like Naruto, I pressed forward, undaunted in spite of all the difficulties I faced.
When I won the match that allowed me to be promoted to 2-kyu, all my doubts flew away in an instant.
Karolina: Yes, but it didn't feel like learning. It was more that the pure joy that came from playing the game is what got me hooked. I took a shogi set with me to school, but would still be completely absorbed in it when I got home all the way up until bedtime. Sometimes I even skipped school to play online. I really wanted to spend every moment I could with the game.
I made a lot of friends and rivals as time went on, and started entering online tournaments as well. Because I hated losing, I did a lot of research and grew to understand shogi further, which made me fall in love with it even more, and then the cycle continued.
—It sounds like you developed several friendships through your many battles, just like Naruto! You first came to Japan in 2011 when you were 19. When did you know that you wanted to study shogi in Japan?
Karolina: I had wanted to visit Japan ever since I got into Japanese manga and anime. However, it's very far away from Poland and I didn't have a lot of money, so I wasn't able to make that happen. But, after I graduated college and began working and saving money, I started thinking more seriously about going. Then, when I was 19 I was able to play an instructional match with Ms. Kitao (Note: Madoka Kitao, professional women's shogi player, 2-dan), and she recommended that I come to Japan if I was interested in becoming a professional.
—When you were asked if you wanted to come to Japan and become a pro, what was your reaction?
Karolina: Of course, I was elated. I'd heard about women's professional shogi in Japan from my friends, and the idea of making a career out of shogi sparked my interest. Naturally, I was anxious about going to live in a far-off country by myself, and my parents were also concerned for my safety because this was right after the Great Tohoku Earthquake. But I knew a chance to become a pro in Japan would likely never come again, so I made the commitment and off I went.
Upon my arrival, I was shocked to learn you could watch shogi matches on TV. It was like a dream come true. And not only that, I could even find people to play against just by going to a shogi hall! To someone like me who had mostly only been able to play online, every day was an amazing experience. Playing face-to-face across a shogi board is a much more personal experience, and it's also a lot easier to sense your opponent's emotions.
—After beginning to study shogi in Japan, did your aspirations toward becoming a professional women's shogi player grow stronger?
Karolina: Yes, but the thing that really hardened my resolve to become a pro was participating in the Ricoh Cup Women's Oza Tournament as the non-Japanese representative in 2012 after temporarily returning to Poland. I was able to win against a professional women's shogi player and that really boosted my confidence.
However, having confidence didn't suddenly make things easy. Becoming a pro was a truly difficult process.
—In 2013, you were accepted into one of the Japan Shogi Association's training groups, working toward becoming a pro while simultaneously continuing your language studies at Yamanashi Gakuin University. What was the most difficult thing about that time in your life?
Karolina: I did a homestay with Ms. Kitao when I initially came to Japan at 19, but when I came back, I was living alone for the first time in my life. I still wasn't confident in my Japanese, so even going to the grocery store was a challenge. I was also busy with my studies, and it was difficult to balance school with shogi.
—But you persevered in your training, and in February of 2017 you were promoted to 2-kyu*, officially becoming the first non-Japanese women's professional shogi player.
*In women's shogi, players are recognized as professionals upon attaining the 2-kyu rank.
Karolina: After reaching 3-kyu, you have to achieve the results necessary to qualify for 2-kyu within two years or you cannot become a professional. I wasn't able to produce great results in my first year after becoming 3-kyu, so the pressure really started building. I remember being afraid that my decision to travel to Japan and all the effort I'd put in would amount to nothing.
But even with all that stress, I never once stopped enjoying shogi. It was hard, but the joy from playing and the fun of learning new things overshadowed that. Just like Naruto, I pressed forward, undaunted in spite of all the difficulties I faced.
When I won the match that allowed me to be promoted to 2-kyu, all my doubts flew away in an instant.
Finding Encouragement From Relating to Naruto
—Naruto learns and grows from each battle he encounters. Have you felt yourself growing the same way through your shogi matches?
Karolina: I think every match provides invaluable experience, but losing is what motivates me. When I became a professional women's shogi player, I was convinced of my own strength, only to get crushed in my debut match. But instead of giving up, I examined the weaknesses the match had revealed in me, and continued practicing in order to overcome them. Naruto was the same. He certainly didn't win every battle he fought.
—Are there any matches you've played that left a deep impression on you?
Karolina: I can think of three specific matches. The first was against Tomoka Nishiyama, a 3-title holder (at the time). I lost, but it was fun to play a good match against such a strong opponent. I could feel the gap between our abilities, and it was a very enriching experience for me.
Then there were my two matches against Ichiyo Shimizu (Note: In 2000, Shimizu obtained 4 queen titles and became the first women's shogi player to reach 6-dan, then became the first to reach 7-dan in 2020). I played against her in 2018 and 2021, and was able to win the first of those matches. She's a legend among female shogi players, so to this day I remember the moment I won against her clearly.
—The stronger the opponent, the more enjoyable and memorable a match becomes. Sounds similar to the mindset of most Shonen Jump protagonists! On that note, out of the NARUTO characters, whose personality and way of thinking do you think resembles yours the most?
Karolina: Shikamaru often says how things are too "troublesome", and I tend to find myself thinking like that and trying to find the easiest way out. He also has great leadership abilities, which is something that I've had to develop in myself in order to spread knowledge about shogi in countries other than Japan, so I can relate to Shikamaru from that angle as well.
Karolina: I think every match provides invaluable experience, but losing is what motivates me. When I became a professional women's shogi player, I was convinced of my own strength, only to get crushed in my debut match. But instead of giving up, I examined the weaknesses the match had revealed in me, and continued practicing in order to overcome them. Naruto was the same. He certainly didn't win every battle he fought.
—Are there any matches you've played that left a deep impression on you?
Karolina: I can think of three specific matches. The first was against Tomoka Nishiyama, a 3-title holder (at the time). I lost, but it was fun to play a good match against such a strong opponent. I could feel the gap between our abilities, and it was a very enriching experience for me.
Then there were my two matches against Ichiyo Shimizu (Note: In 2000, Shimizu obtained 4 queen titles and became the first women's shogi player to reach 6-dan, then became the first to reach 7-dan in 2020). I played against her in 2018 and 2021, and was able to win the first of those matches. She's a legend among female shogi players, so to this day I remember the moment I won against her clearly.
—The stronger the opponent, the more enjoyable and memorable a match becomes. Sounds similar to the mindset of most Shonen Jump protagonists! On that note, out of the NARUTO characters, whose personality and way of thinking do you think resembles yours the most?
Karolina: Shikamaru often says how things are too "troublesome", and I tend to find myself thinking like that and trying to find the easiest way out. He also has great leadership abilities, which is something that I've had to develop in myself in order to spread knowledge about shogi in countries other than Japan, so I can relate to Shikamaru from that angle as well.
But if we're talking about how things were when I was a child, I was more like Naruto, I think.
—There certainly seems to be quite a bit of overlap between Naruto's dogged pursuit of his dream to become Hokage, and your hard work and perseverance toward your goal of becoming a professional shogi player.
—There certainly seems to be quite a bit of overlap between Naruto's dogged pursuit of his dream to become Hokage, and your hard work and perseverance toward your goal of becoming a professional shogi player.
Karolina: When I left Poland, I was very single-minded in my desire to play shogi and to become a professional, so I guess that drive may have resembled Naruto's determination to become Hokage. I also think I gained a lot of courage from seeing a child hold on to his dream and persevere in the face of difficult circumstances. When I became a pro, I even did Naruto's thumbs-up pose to celebrate (laughs)
—Finally, will you tell us what dreams you're pursuing at the moment?
Karolina: Just like how Naruto became a leader in the ninja world, I want to take the lead in the world of shogi and increase its popularity outside of Japan. Though there are other international shogi players aside from me, I'd like to see our numbers grow more and more. There's currently a worldwide shogi competition (the International Shogi Tournament), but the level of the players is nothing compared to the pros in Japan. I think it'd be interesting and a lot more exciting if the number of strong players from around the world increased. For now, while I dream of when that day will come, I'll continue to convey the joy of shogi to everyone.
Karolina: Just like how Naruto became a leader in the ninja world, I want to take the lead in the world of shogi and increase its popularity outside of Japan. Though there are other international shogi players aside from me, I'd like to see our numbers grow more and more. There's currently a worldwide shogi competition (the International Shogi Tournament), but the level of the players is nothing compared to the pros in Japan. I think it'd be interesting and a lot more exciting if the number of strong players from around the world increased. For now, while I dream of when that day will come, I'll continue to convey the joy of shogi to everyone.
Interview/Compilation: Noriyuki Enami (Yajirobe)
